COPYRIGHT and UNLICENSE TERMS (can we use code for free or not)

[ThRuST]

Hello world I'd like to shed some light on this fact

Everybodys code snippets are the owned property of each author.
And it will so remain until everybody attach a UNLICENSE notification together with the files or source code. But nobody does this. How can we feel safe and sure when we distribute an application of our own that it all code belongs to ourselves, including original and modified code snippets, and the use of official libraries posted in this forum, that does not demand any payment to the author, except a donation that is done freely. And how about wrappers that programmers do for other programming languages, well you get the idea from all I've said so far. I am thinking about this these days because I plan to have my software distributed worldwide, at least that's past of my vision. So far some really good programmers in this forum supported my vision and helped me out here and there so to speak. Well you know how it works just as well as myself. I've found that there's a type called terms of UNLICENSE, which means if it's part of files in a folder it means 'free for anyone to copy', so basically we're all not allowed to distribute an application of our own if it contains parts of code that other people have written.
Please post your comments on this and what do you think about it all. Thanks

 

[ThRuST]

Here's the terms of UNLICENSE, you can check it out here

 

[keirS]

Erel posted on this a long time ago.

https://www.b4x.com/android/forum/threads/important-notice-about-libraries-license.12556/#content

All libraries posted by forum members unless otherwise stated are released under the creative commons licence. Creative commons is highly permissive so in theory decompiling and modifying the source code and redistributing it is OK if no other licence is mentioned. The core libraries released with each B4X product are covered in the T&C's of that product.

I am not sure how many library developers realize this is the case though as it's a very old post and not stickied.

 

[sorex]

if you can't distribute code that's not 100% written by yourself then you should write in assembler

all the rest has code 'written' by someone else (the compiled code and it's base/core libs)

 

[sorex]

about the libs... I guess it depends on how the seller sells it.

1 license for everything
or 1 license per end customer

I think most people use the first option.

 

[ThRuST]

@sorex Interesting statement. But I guess most of us left Assembly language behind with the death of Commodore 64 to unite in OOP as one big family

 

[ThRuST]

@sorex 1 license for everything is probably the common understanding, but what the masses believe and the LAW says, that might differ

 

[ThRuST]

@sorex I am sure there's code snippets available on the net for assembly language. Since it came before B4X

 

[ThRuST]

About the Creative Commons terms, it can be found here
Creative commons wtf? never heard about it :-D

 

[sorex]

just wondering... will you put other peoples names into your own app?

I doubt many people will do that but still use these CC 'elements' in their apps.

It will look even more odd when you do that in an app that you made for a customer.

 

[ThRuST]

My personal standpoint is that everybody who helps and contributes to someone elses vision should be respectfully mentioned among the credits,
and if the final app becomes successful in a way that it generates money, each one mentioned should be rewarded in a way that is a reasonable share of their work and the generated profit.

This then becomes a very personal question depending what kind of person we all are. Some people find it very easy to turn their backs towards someone and move on
even though they helped out alot, and a classic example is when Steve Jobs didn't tell the truth to Steve Wozniak about the financial value from the Atari game Pinball.
It later led to that Wozniak walked away from friendship and I assume he didn't care so much about money compared to trust in their long-term frienship.

This is just my personal oppinions and it is a very personal preference which decisions is being made and who to ally with. But this makes sense to me.
I know many contacts from the past who get a good career and at that point choosed to turn thrir backs on people including me. I find that hard to understand myself.

 

[ThRuST]

I'd like to add to my previous answer that it might be a good decision to respect those who believe in your own visions, because 1. They deserve recognition just like youself 2.In case your app becomes successful you might need their help again 3.It's difficult to succeed with a one man project so a wise business network with the best they can find and reward their future employees for it.

Just my three cents

 

[ThRuST]

4. The day you realize that you're no smarter than anybody else and cannot do everything yourself, that's when you've leveled up to the next stage that is a step closer to success because you dare to ask for help and the more help you get the faster you complete your projects. Then if you can "sell shit" you might even be rich and famous for it

 

[sorex]

I understand your vision but if some people on this forum got €1 for each problem they solved with or without code snippets they could live from it.

I doubt that's the case.

Most people's gratitude stops at "thanks" and donations are rare and can be counted on 1 hand (read finger ) for an entire year.

I sent out some paypal donations aswell when I was stuck and someone helped me out.
See it as a re-investment of the (minimal) earned ads money so it didn't cost you anything in the end as it is a cut of earnings/profit.

Unfortunately some people only take the short road and have mainly copy paste projects and if it becomes successfull pay or ad-wise I doubt some of the cash rolls back to the forum members who posted the code or example projects. It's just like that.

 

[Star-Dust]

I understand your vision but if some people on this forum got €1 for each problem they solved with or without code snippets they could live from it.

I doubt that's the case.

Most people's gratitude stops at "thanks" and donations are rare and can be counted on 1 hand (read finger ) for an entire year.

I sent out some paypal donations aswell when I was stuck and someone helped me out.
See it as a re-investment of the (minimal) earned ads money so it didn't cost you anything in the end as it is a cut of earnings/profit.

Unfortunately some people only take the short road and have mainly copy paste projects and if it becomes successfull pay or ad-wise I doubt some of the cash rolls back to the forum members who posted the code or example projects. It's just like that.

The forum is born to give free assistance. Also because sometimes only small problems or simple questions asked by newbies.
In other words, questions we might ask the desk colleague without paying.

Obviously for more important advice I would ask for a fee, as when they ask you to make a library or code for an App.

There is another circumstance to consider, if you carry out a library that you distribute with a donation, you will give free assistance, but have already made a donation that should cover your costs.
Then if you distribute them for free, just give your little assistance to your good heart

 

[sorex]

I see you're 2 years on this forum.

I'm here since 2012 and I've seen a lot of developers who made libs either for free or payable that just gave up because people kept asking for improvements or fixes.

You need to draw a line somewhere.

If you pay €5 for a library you can't expect to get 24/7 support and life time updates or feature requests.

If only 5 people bought the lib the dev can't work all the time on a product that made only €25 so far.

If you have a constant stream of sales that's another thing and it's a motivator to continue on that product.

 

[Star-Dust]

I see you're 2 years on this forum.

I'm here since 2012 and I've seen a lot of developers who made libs either for free or payable that just gave up because people kept asking for improvements or fixes.

You need to draw a line somewhere.

If you pay €5 for a library you can't expect to get 24/7 support and life time updates or feature requests.

If only 5 people bought the lib the dev can't work all the time on a product that made only €25 so far.

If you have a constant stream of sales that's another thing and it's a motivator to continue on that product.

I agree with you.
In fact I have adopted a different strategy that satisfies both parties. But it does not seem to me the right place to talk about it. Also because I would be off topic

But I share with you that in order to offer some assistance it must also be economically convenient

 

[ThRuST]

@Star-Dust I respect what you're saying and your hard earned skills, however there's one thing that differs our views and that it:
I'm in it for the creative process and the passion of it, and money is not a motivator. I don't need that and I never found a need for it either.
Let me tell you life from my angle. I am supported by some of the best programmers who share and respect my vision, and that's what counts.
All the way to the bank as to put it with your own words. But hey, the best friends are not into it for the money. The sit up days and night just
because they love what they do until the burnout syndrome knocks on their door. In this case mine. Do I regret it : Yes. can I let go of my visions : No.
The way I see it you're completely right about everything, but you left out the most important thing: Love and passion for the creative process.
If it leads to money or not is not the most important thing, you see if you fail that's just another unsuccessful session of yours, and if it succeeds,
well then we'll never know about it, right?

 

[Star-Dust]

Love and passion are the engine of the best.

Here you will find many who have love and passion for computer science and have shared a lot of code for free and given free help.

The likes we have are the answers of those who have helped. This forum is alive for the generosity that someone has expressed.

It is also evident that we do not live only in good deeds, some for the time that he has dedicated to some library, asking for a contribution with a donation. Surely the few euros are nothing compared to the cost that you should face to buy libraries on other languages. And they do not repay the time spent to create and assist those who use them.

But making a donation demonstrates the appreciation and respect for the work of others, who like you have spent time to create an instrument with which you can work.

 

[AnandGupta]

As basic as understanding that if one takes codes, snippets, source etc. from freely available website, forum, books etc. and makes a new, similar etc. product, he/she can at least release new, changed, enhanced version of codes, snippets, sources etc. for next generation.

Take and Give. Help the community. Keep it alive.

Regards,

Anand