Advertisements in your app

I just wanted to start this discussion not on how to make money using ads, but on the ethics and morality of including ads with your apps.

It seems like there is a general negative attitude towards ads especially in mobile and desktop applications. This however seems to be more biased than in other fields.

Advertisements exist everywhere. Large corporations have very large marketing and advertisement departments, which may well contain more employees than the rest of the company. They need it to make money.
On smaller scales we advertise everyday. By wearing what we wear, eating what we eat. We influence the decisions of our friends and force them to buy Android phones ...we advertise.

There are billboards all over the city. We do not attempt to take them down.
There are ads in the newspapers. We do not stop reading newspapers.
There are ads in every program in TV. We get annoyed but there is nothing we can do, we have to watch them.
There are ads on google and many other websites. We still use them.

So why is there so much more negativity against ads in apps? No one likes ads but they were co-existing happily for the past 60 or more years?

I have an idea that this is because there is 'choice'. When there was no choice people had to accept the ads but now if people can get the same products without ads they will DEMAND it! Give them choice and they will bicker and complain and try to stay away from ads.

I am not an advocate of ads, neither do I like them. Infact, I am against 'media' in general and the force-fed nature. However I am trying to start an objective discussion into peoples psychology and how to make ads acceptable or our apps monetisable while keeping people happy.

Is the limited screen size of many devices a factor?

People see the space taken by ads as wasted - if the ads are of no interest to them.

Martin.

Ads have to exist, otherwise we, small devs wouldn't make a cent out of apps. An ad is more like 'Donate for free' button.

Neither do I like ads, but thedesolatesoul got a point. An application, whatever is free or shareware, cost time and money for the developer. Not just to build it, but he has to develop and support it.There are plenty of ways to display an advertisement and most of them are clever and efficient. An ad could be a pop-up balloon appearing for only 2 seconds, or it can be hidden in the application menu, or finally can be just a splash on application initialization. It doesn't have to be heavy or annoying.
On the other hand, a "free" application is not necessary a full of ads application. It can be donateware software, or just an application. Some apps are a stand-alone advertisement itself. If a small app is very smooth and popular, the next project of the developer will have an advantage.

warwound said:

Is the limited screen size of many devices a factor?

People see the space taken by ads as wasted - if the ads are of no interest to them.

Click to expand...

Possibly. As long as the ads arent like popups or annoying or invading the app space. This could be a factor but Google Admob ads are quite small and if put in a corner may go unnoticed. (which actually makes it harder to make money!)

You are also suggesting the ads need to be of interest to the user?
I have heard this idea, but in my experience with computers I have only clicked on ads maybe 5 times in my life due to interest. The rest were by mistake.

Kamac said:

Ads have to exist, otherwise we, small devs wouldn't make a cent out of apps. An ad is more like 'Donate for free' button.

Click to expand...

I hear ya bro, but honestly I could live off the streets much easily rather than earn money through ads as a 'small dev'.
I'm developing apps after coming back from a full time job, if all it is going to bring me is £5 a month then I'd rather go work in a supermarket (not really ...i love programming!)
I mean, just look at the scale of economics

adamioan said:

Neither do I like ads, but thedesolatesoul got a point. An application, whatever is free or shareware, cost time and money for the developer. Not just to build it, but he has to develop and support it.There are plenty of ways to display an advertisement and most of them are clever and efficient. An ad could be a pop-up balloon appearing for only 2 seconds, or it can be hidden in the application menu, or finally can be just a splash on application initialization. It doesn't have to be heavy or annoying.
On the other hand, a "free" application is not necessary a full of ads application. It can be donateware software, or just an application. Some apps are a stand-alone advertisement itself. If a small app is very smooth and popular, the next project of the developer will have an advantage.

Click to expand...

That is exactly how I think of it. But think if an ad appears for 2 seconds on a splash screen (out of which it took 1 second to fetch the ad), how many people can click on it. You know you wont make money if the ad is not visible.
And you are right, for promotion it is good to build a reputation and customer base.

Kamac said:

An ad is more like 'Donate for free' button.

Click to expand...

Why not use a donate button instead of ads?

If i was a user of your app, your chance to earn some money would be much better with a donate button. ads wouldn't generate a penny for you on my phone, because i never click them.

Djembefola said:

Why not use a donate button instead of ads?

If i was a user of your app, your chance to earn some money would be much better with a donate button. ads wouldn't generate a penny for you on my phone, because i never click them.

Click to expand...

Interesting, Donations vs Advertisements.
PROS Donations:
The choice seems to be in the user's hands so the user feels more empowered.
The user has a better image of the developer.
CONS Donations:
The developer feels like he is getting charity, does not feel empowered.
Not a reliable stream of money - very spurious

Any other comparisons?

Maybe donate button would be better, but not everyone want to actually bother sending you money throught paypal (if they even have one!). And ad is just click&free to donate.

Kamac said:

Maybe donate button would be better, but not everyone want to actually bother sending you money throught paypal (if they even have one!). And ad is just click&free to donate.

Click to expand...

Yes, but CPC is so low! One click will get you 0.20 cents?
But yes you are right, not everyone has paypal, and not everyone has the urge to donate...especially young people dont feel much like donating (because many dont even have money!) whereas older people dont use their phone as much.

Another interesting thing I was thinking when using your Security Manager was: WHEN is the user likely to click on an ad?
When he is in the middle of a game? I dont think so. They are in the middle of something interesting, even if the ad is related they will not click on it. Especially on a mobile phone, it opens a browser on top and you lose your original app window.


People are most likely to open ads on browsers, but in a different tab, or somewhere in the side, not in the middle of an app.

Yeh, i guess i've failed the ads. But they're never ever interesting, so actually people click on them just to help you if they feel like to do it.

thedesolatesoul said:

Yes, but CPC is so low! One click will get you 0.20 cents?

Click to expand...

That' s true, but there are some exclusions. Creating a feedback option in application menu and an "Advertising" you can make your customer list and bill your own prices, without using Goggle Mobile Adwords or any other provider. In fact I am developing an application that provides information about all greek cinemas and movies for every week. This has to be updated often enough, so user must be online to use it. This means that all the advertisements (if there are any) could be refreshed or renewed. This kind of application provides many installations by many visitors, because its a daily routine to check what is going on in cinemas.
Placing this option on the menu, and kindly appear some ads in activity, can cause a good earning. For example, you can hire the area of a roller banner and be paid just for displaying the ad; this means that clicking is extra bill.

Kamac said:

Yeh, i guess i've failed the ads. But they're never ever interesting, so actually people click on them just to help you if they feel like to do it.

Click to expand...

Yes, then there is your idea to add a 'help us' button and ask people to click on it. It makes people aware that in order to support developers they need to click the adverts.

adamioan said:

That' s true, but there are some exclusions. Creating a feedback option in application menu and an "Advertising" you can make your customer list and bill your own prices, without using Goggle Mobile Adwords or any other provider. In fact I am developing an application that provides information about all greek cinemas and movies for every week. This has to be updated often enough, so user must be online to use it. This means that all the advertisements (if there are any) could be refreshed or renewed. This kind of application provides many installations by many visitors, because its a daily routine to check what is going on in cinemas.
Placing this option on the menu, and kindly appear some ads in activity, can cause a good earning. For example, you can hire the area of a roller banner and be paid just for displaying the ad; this means that clicking is extra bill.

Click to expand...

This is an exception though. But how will you manage your advertisers? They will want to know number of impressions/clicks. You can use Google Analytics maybe but they need some kind of confirmation?
But I had though of this option too and it is hard to get advertisers.
Let us know how this goes though. Very interesting

Yes, then there is your idea to add a 'help us' button and ask people to click on it. It makes people aware that in order to support developers they need to click the adverts.

Click to expand...

Yeah. That's kinda my idea. I hope it'll work.

Here is an interesting report for developers:
http://cdn.androidpolice.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/NielsenMobileAppsWhitepaper.pdf

I think we need to research on adverts opening INSIDE the app rather than outside.

Me again, my friend , with another warning. Sorry.

Asking users to click on the ads is another violation of the admob rules which might lead to the suspension of your account.

I don't want to be so pessimistic but be careful.

Kamac said:

Yeah. That's kinda my idea. I hope it'll work.

Click to expand...

Sent from my HTC HD2

:sign0142:

or wait...

...:sign0085:

I guess i'll change that

admob-rules (which i guess are the same for Adsense if you activated it):

Content Guidelines | Welcome to AdMob Help

In my first release of my app with ads, I also encouraged my users to click occasionally on the ads but after reading "better" the rules and many stories on the internet where publishers have had their accounts suspended (and loosing any revenues), I immediately took away that "request".

Better be on the safe side!

Yesterday some idea hit me. When someone cannot sell his game, or even when he does, but it doesn't sell, he can put up ads. But ads are giving really small revenue... So why not to use micro-payments? Like purchasing additional levels, gold for your character etc. Even by SMS? It could bring lots more money! (Or even take one fee for multiplayer of 1$) What do you think?

But that again requires that you are able to receive payments in your country (like Android market does not support right now).
Maybe using PayPal directly, which allows a server to push an update to the phone.
In-app Billing | Android Developers
https://www.paypal-business.co.uk/take-micropayments-with-paypal/index.htm
Flattr on your Android phone - Flattr4Android

I think it also depends on how you use the micropayments options.
For e.g. MMORPGs allow you to buy weapons, gold etc...that you will eventually receive anyway by levelling up. So I dont like this idea because it does not unlock any additional options just relies on peoples impatience. (Although this would work).
If you use it to unlock new features, like multiplayer, level packs etc, it makes very much more sense to me.
Just dont overuse it, for e.g. asking payment for each level.

If you use it to unlock new features, like multiplayer, level packs etc, it makes very much more sense to me.

Click to expand...

This is what i think of.

Ofcourse, they require that damn google checkout merchant (or something like that) acc. which i cannot use because i am from Poland... Jesus Christ, will they ever expand it?

BTW. Does anybody else has problems with his app downloads statistics?

BTW2. I must use some micro-payments, as i cannot sell my games, nor use admob since it is bringing 0.0$ revenue.