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What do you think about cryptomoney ? bitcoin,litecoin etc
- Thread starter tufanv
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For me it's not a matter of guessing, but a solid opinion built on my own calculations and analysis.
Remember the first law of thermodynamics.
If you want to know the future of bitcoin then the right place to start your research is the beginning of this concept.
Remember the first law of thermodynamics.
If you want to know the future of bitcoin then the right place to start your research is the beginning of this concept.
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dont know about biggest but its certainly up there at the top of the list.
Even Einstein couldn't have commented more smartly. Same answer with different package name
It depends on how much faith you have in your government's currency and your banking system.
You need to ask the people in India who had their 500 & 1000 rupee notes deemed worthless by the government 2 weeks ago whether it was a good idea to invest in Bitcoin last year. Exchanging their currency at the bank takes hours waiting in line and you can only redeem a small amount at a time. If you cannot prove you paid tax on the money you are redeeming, the bank confiscates it. It is estimated the government got to confiscate trillions rupees that was in circulation. Last week the same Indian government started confiscating some of the people's gold jewelry, which is in abundant supply in India. They have implemented strict rules on how much gold a person in India can possess. The price of gold in India shot up temporarily to over $2200/oz last week. All of this chaos has occurred in the past 3 weeks. The Indian government is after money, and a lot of it. You have to ask yourself why? Why now?
Ask the people in Venezuela who are undergoing inflation rates of over 700% this year whether they should have put their money in Bitcoin last year? Next year their inflation rate is expected to top 1600%. Their paper currency has turned into toilet paper. 6 months ago the people of Venezuela could no longer feed their pets so they let them loose. Their neighbors who were also starving would trap them and eat them. Their zoo was broken into by roving crowds and they killed and ate a prize stallion, the only horse of its kind in the country. Other zoo animals were consumed for food. Yesterday the Venezuelan government called out the national guard to try and stop the violence. It is a little late for that. A single silver dollar can buy a months food in Venezuela. Had the population divested themselves of their fiat paper currency for real money like gold & silver or Bitcoin, many could have been saved.
And what about you? How does this affect you? It is happening over there, not over here. So we're safe, right? Not so fast.
Most people don't realize the implications of the Banker Bail-in Laws that were passed by the U.S., Europe, Canada, Australia and New Zealand in 2012 and 2013. There are no more bail-outs for the banks. Instead there will be bail-ins. What's the difference you ask? A bail-out is where the government bails out the banks with taxpayer money to keep the banks solvent, which is what happened in 2008. A bail-in is where the bank if it is about to fail, can legally default on its bond holders and pay them a fraction of what they are owed. The bank at its discretion, can also seize money from depositors's accounts. That's right, they can take money out of your savings account, checking accounts, and CD's too. They will replace it with worthless bank stock. If you think this can't happen, well it already did in Cyprus 3 years ago. Depositors in Cyprus took a hair cut of around 44%. That includes business accounts. Many businesses had to layoff employees or close their doors because the banks took their money. This wasn't just one bank in Cyprus, but all banks in Cyprus. If you had money in a Cyprus bank, you lost 44% of it. The rest of your money could only be withdrawn in small amounts at a time, and only if you waited in long lines at the ATM.
The German government wants to bail-out Deutsche Bank because it is insolvent. It lost billions of euros last quarter. Its stock price is down 90% from what it was 18 months ago. The ECB wants to enact the banker bail-in clause so the bank can default on their bonds and possibly seize customer's accounts. If this happens, it will create a bank run on other European banks. BTW, Deutsche Bank is sitting on $42 Trillion in derivatives that will unwind (blow up) if it goes under. It will be Lehman Bros times 5! This will take down the European banking system and the American banks as well. The banks will fall like dominoes.
Pension funds around the world are tied up in bank bonds like those issued by Deutsche Bank because they were considered safe. If there is a banker bail-in many pension funds will be hurt and distributions will have to be cut. People may have to survive on only half of their monthly pension. This is going to be impossible with a high inflation rate. The German government wants to do a bail-out and avoid bank runs, but this means using public money. Angela Merkel is up for re-election next year and a bail-out will nix her chances of getting re-elected. Several of the largest Italian banks are also insolvent and needs billions in money to stay afloat. Portugal, Spain and France are not far behind. The ECB may have to step in and print tens (hundreds?) of billions of Euros to save the European banking system, which of course will devalue the Euro and will cause inflation.
Most people think their bank accounts are insured from loss. FDIC in the U.S. insures bank deposits up to $250,000. At least that's what people think. But that's not quite true. There is approximately $10 Trillion sitting on deposit in customer accounts in the U.S. in their savings and checking accounts etc.. The FDIC has only $40 billion in cash to insure this amount. So you can see the insurance coverage is woefully inadequate with a coverage of only 0.4%. A single large bank failure can bankrupt the FDIC. Yes they can get bailed out, but that means printing a lot money. CitiGroup and Bank of America are two Wall Street banks that are technically insolvent.
But it gets worse. The Omnibus bill that passed by Congress in December 2014 allowed Wall Street derivatives to be insured by the FDIC. That's right. Taxpayers are on the hook for the Wall Street derivatives to the tune of over $70 Trillion. How can it get any worse than this? Well, it can. During a banking collapse, the derivatives are paid off first, leaving the depositor (you and me) out in the cold. So your bank accounts are not really insured if there is a major banking collapse.
The way I see it we have two problems facing us. A banking collapse and a currency collapse. If major banks collapse and the government does a bail-out, it devalues the currency. If they do a bail-in, the depositors can lose a lot of their money.
Now you may ask yourself, if you are still reading this, what does this have to do with Bitcoin? When a banking collapse or currency collapse occurs, people will flee to safer forms of money, namely physical gold and silver that they can keep in their possession. But the supply of physical gold and silver will dry up within hours of such a collapse and the price will skyrocket. But people still need to get rid of their fiat currency will have to turn to other places like Bitcoin, which will send the price soaring. They will put their fiat money into anything that has intrinsic value. Those with lots of fiat paper will choose gold and silver first, followed by Bitcoin and its derivatives. Those without a lot of money will choose food and consumer staples. Those who do nothing, well, these will be the people who chase after pets or form roving gangs that break into stores and clean them out in the first couple of weeks of panic.
So is BitCoin a scam? I would prefer to invest in physical gold or silver myself. But BitCoin is less of a scam than fiat currency and less of a scam than the banking system. People are blatantly ignorant of where money comes from and this is by design. If people discovered how fiat currency is made or how the banking system worked, there would be a revolution tomorrow.
P.S. If you think BitCoin is a scam, why has Wall Street developed their own blockchain currency that will compete with BitCoin?
I hope this has helped someone. If not, well, I've wasted an hour of my time.
Thank for the answers. For me , I do not think to invest a world just a very small money which can grow with time but bitcoin's time about big increase is passed i think. It was a rapid increase in last 5 years , it is still going up but i dont think it is time to invest. Other coins are not so popular but i will try my luck with a not popular coin if i decide to try .
For BitCoin to cease to exist, the Internet has to cease to exist. You must realize that BitCoin is a worldwide currency. You can transfer $100k to any person in any country for pennies without using a 3rd party. There is no middleman to go through. If you tried to use a bank to Transfer $100k it would cost you around $5,000 in hidden fees. It can also take several days to get there using a bank whereas BitCoin may take 5 minutes or less.
Now you may be confusing risk with BitCoin Exchanges like Mt Gox that went under because it lost millions of dollars of BitCoin. This was the fault of the exchange. No one should store their BitCoins in an exchange. You keep it on several flash drives and backed up. Mt Gox was like a bank, that because of bad security or internal theft, lost a lot of BitCoins. That doesn't mean the BitCoin security is flawed.
China for the past 4 months have been buying lots and lots of BitCoins. Why? Because the Chinese gov't keeps devaluing their yuan so they need to flee to safety.
BitCoin was $250 in late 2015. Today it is around $792. A large chunk of that price increase is due to the demand in China.
Watch the BitCoins being purchased by China in this realtime map.
http://fiatleak.com
Here is the BitCoin price chart.
https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/#charts
What scares me most is the Financial vs. Real economy. It was said that Financial (i.e. almost fake numbers generated by computers) is valued 70 times the worldwide GNP (Gross National Product). I know very little about Economy, but when fantasy papers value more than tangible stuff I feel uncomfortable.
Gold has a value because is a scarce resource. So goes for water and almost any goods. Same for lands used for the primary sector.
But when we come to shares, derivatives and other "bet tools" we see value fluctuations due to a CEO's speech or agencies publishing far from unbiased forecasts or speculation or any other accident able to influence that bit-economy.
udg
Gold has a value because is a scarce resource. So goes for water and almost any goods. Same for lands used for the primary sector.
But when we come to shares, derivatives and other "bet tools" we see value fluctuations due to a CEO's speech or agencies publishing far from unbiased forecasts or speculation or any other accident able to influence that bit-economy.
udg
@udg
The theory of (value) is a little tricky.. Even gold is in fact just another metal that in itself has no value more than any rock or piece of wood.. It's us who give it the value more than other objects.. If you are in the desert and hungry.. and no life in sight, then out of the blue a vendor came up selling sandwitches.. you can buy the first sandwitch for $100 if the seller said so.. But you would't pay more than $50 for the second one.. Now say another seller popped up and offered the same sandwitches.. At this time you wouldn't pay more the $2.5. In economics this is called Law of Diminishing of Value.
Now talking about bitcoin, this scheme assumes a bitcoin carries intrinsic value..in other words, it is a value in itself, and this contradicts with any economic principle. I don't care how big banks and instutions are dealing with it.. We all know banks are gamblers and they just found a new casino.
The theory of (value) is a little tricky.. Even gold is in fact just another metal that in itself has no value more than any rock or piece of wood.. It's us who give it the value more than other objects.. If you are in the desert and hungry.. and no life in sight, then out of the blue a vendor came up selling sandwitches.. you can buy the first sandwitch for $100 if the seller said so.. But you would't pay more than $50 for the second one.. Now say another seller popped up and offered the same sandwitches.. At this time you wouldn't pay more the $2.5. In economics this is called Law of Diminishing of Value.
Now talking about bitcoin, this scheme assumes a bitcoin carries intrinsic value..in other words, it is a value in itself, and this contradicts with any economic principle. I don't care how big banks and instutions are dealing with it.. We all know banks are gamblers and they just found a new casino.
I hate to tell you this, but you don't have any money in the bank.
You don't own the money you have in the bank. It is NOT your money any more. When you deposit YOUR money in the bank, you have actually LENT the money to the bank and the bank now OWNS the money and they can do with it what they want. You are an unsecured creditor. What that means is if the bank collapses, you are one of the last ones to get paid.
The bank gives you a pass book with entries in it showing you have money in the bank. This is really a ledger of what the bank owes you. Bernie Madoff did the same thing. He printed up statements showing how much people had in their accounts. It was all fiction. The money isn't really there. The banking system only works if fewer than 10% of the people demand their money back. Any more than that and the bank is in serious trouble. That is why I suspect banks in Australia, U.S., and a few other countries are thinking of banning large denomination notes like the $100 bill. They don't want the people to have the ability to withdraw large amounts of cash from the banking system.
Did you know the FDIC does NOT cover fraud or hacking at the bank? If some big bad Russian hacks into your bank and steals your money, don't bother contacting the FDIC. The bank has to have its own insurance to cover this type of loss, and chances are they only have partial coverage. This works fine if the hacker steals money from only a few accounts. If money from all of the accounts are stolen, then the bank has a serious problem.
Really? I have a cord of wood. Would you be willing to trade it for an equivalent amount of gold? If not, then they must have different values.
You're right when you say it is all about supply and demand. Gold and silver have been used for money for the past 5,000 years. We used to have $20 gold pieces up until 1933, and these gold coins were commonly found in our pockets. But FDR outlawed the use of gold in the U.S. and bought it from Americans at around $24/oz. Then when he got all of the gold, he revalued it at $35/oz. This devalued the U.S. dollar by 33% literally overnight and the U.S. dollar became a fiat currency that has no intrinsic value.
BitCoins do have intrinsic value. Only 22 million BitCoins can ever be produced. Today it takes a great deal of resources (energy and time) to mine (produce) a single BitCoin. When BitCoins first came out, you could have your computer produce a dozen BitCoins overnight, and many people did. But today it could take weeks or even months to produce a single Bitcoin. Much like gold or oil. All of the easy gold and oil has already been discovered. Now it takes more resources to bring the gold and oil to the surface. BitCoin is the same.
Bankers are scared senseless of BitCoin, if it ever gains popularity. Right now it is still in the fringe, but if the general population uses it, it is the end of the banking system as we know it. The general population is unaware of BitCoins true potential. It reaches far beyond being just a currency. That is why Wall Street banks are developing their own blockchain currency and have even hired one of the original BitCoin developers. If the banks don't evolve and adopt this new technology, they will go the way of the dinosaurs.
You can keep your paper currency if you like. But it is fiat paper, and has no intrinsic value. There have been thousands of fiat currencies in the past 200 years. None of them have survived without massive devaluation. In the past 100 years the U.S. dollar has lost 98% of its purchasing power. But a gold coin from 2,000 years ago still buys the same amount of goods as it does today. It's funny how more people put their faith in paper currency rather than real money like gold or silver or even BitCoin.
BTW, where do you want the wood delivered? I expect full payment of 6,000 pounds of gold on delivery for the cord of wood (equal weight). Tell your friends I will offer them the same deal. You're going to be a real popular person if this catches on. Probably more so than the Europeans (backed by bankers) who bought Manhattan from the Indians for $24 of beads and trinkets.
I hope you are not saying you are more smart than me. I also know they have different values..
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Will get back to your 2 posts above.. They need a little more time.